Crow on-line individual running log?
Posted by EG on October 25, 2004 at 12:04:56:

how hard would it be to put a link where each crow could put a continual running log. Something that could be a little more in depth, where we could put how we felt, weather, and other things, and be able to go to one place and see are running week by week, and compare month to month, and even better year to year. Just a thought, other clubs and runners have there journals out there on this world wide web, why can't we crows? its something good to reference, good to refer to, and something nice to share. Its also nice to see whats working for other runners that might also work for us. here is an example of ryan bak's. ryan ran at trinity, and know he's running for a USA team in souther california...its very interesting...http://www.run-insight.com/journals-sumfall04-bak12.html

Posted by Harry B. on October 25, 2004 at 13:43:57:
In Reply to: Crow on-line individual running log? posted by EG on October 25, 2004 at 12:04:56:

great idea...I wonder what Brian thinks...

Brian likes the idea
Posted by Brian on October 25, 2004 at 15:19:28:
In Reply to: great idea...I wonder what Brian thinks... posted by Harry B. on October 25, 2004 at 13:43:57:

just don't know how it might work technically. That's essentially what the daily log is -- as there's no limit to what you can write in.

I guess the difference might be the way the info could be sorted, e.g. being able to check out two week's worth of Judson's workout in one place.

AS I suggested earlier, I'm happy to include both trianing plans and logs linked to the 'Training Talk' page. I think the Message Board is the place for people to enter whatever they want either daily, weekly, or monthly. And if there are other files members would like me to put up on our server for them I can do that too.

Welcome any suggestions -- always.

MATT'S AMAZING ON-LINE RUNNING-LOG DIATRIBE!!!!
Posted by matt on November 13, 2004 at 08:52:47:

I no longer have broadband internet, so I'm no longer compulsively checking the message board, which I suppose is a good thing...but while scrolling through past entries recently, I came upon Evan's post regarding a centralized running log for Crow members to share their training information with each other, so I thought I'd respond.

Having a place where we could all check-up on each other's training would be a wonderful addition to this site and would certainly go a long way towards improving everyone's performance. I for one would like to be able to see how others are structuring their marathon training. I'm by no means a computer expert, but I do have enough knowledge about website development to have some idea as to what is feasible for our website.

A Look at Evan's Link

I looked at the link Evan provided as an example of what he had in mind, and it looked fairly straight-forward; a simple html page, that most likely is updated manually. This means someone is logging onto the website server and altering the mark-up whenever they make a new entry. This would be a simple solution were our website devoted to a small number of runners, but in regards to our situation, this would not be feasible, as it would require multiple people accessing the server (a security risk) and editing personal pages (Which requires some html skills.)

If everyone had their own websites where they could post their training schedules, we could then post links to these sites on the Crow website. This is something we might want to do anyway for those of us who have personal websites, (blogs and such,) but creating a personal website requires an investment of time and money that many of us would rather spend elsewhere (on shoes and running!)

What About The "Daily Log" On The Message Board?

What we have in place now, with the "Daily Log" on the message board, is a great way for us to share with each other what we are doing from day to day. But in terms of long-term utility and expandability, using the message board for logging runs poses some problems. Let's say EVERYONE in the club decided they wanted to post their daily run; that would make for quite a mess on the message board. And what of the data? None of the information posted on the message board is saved or capable of being interpreted statistically; but then, that is not the purpose of the message board. The board does a great job of allowing us to communicate, but to achieve the sort of thing Evan suggested, would require something more powerful, something that utilized a database to store and interpret data. Brian has lately advocated the shift to a database-backed message board, and such a shift would enhance the Daily Log feature. Such a change would allow for greater control over categorizing and archiving posts, as well as increasing security and limiting abuse by unwelcome third-parties (porn spammers, etc.) An example of what such a thing would look like can be found here. (This example uses the exact same software as Brian has suggested.)

If the club were to adopt the new message board program, we could then create a specific forum devoted solely to members' daily log entries, as well as forums for training advice, race planning, announcements, etc. By having posts categorized, information could be garnered more easily, and old posts wouldn't suffer the fate of being pushed so quickly to the bottom of the heap. Also, such a configuration might make the forum less intimidating to club newbies, and "lurkers", who might not feel comfortable diving into the constant free-form banter we all so enjoy.

Changing the message board to a database-backed system would be a step towards realizing Evan's idea, but it would still be a long way from actually achieving it. Though discussions about training might be enhanced, the information shared would still be lost eventually, and would still not lend itself to statistical interpretation. Such a thing as Evan has suggested, would require a specialized database, custom-built for our website; the sort of thing companies pay tens-of-thousands of dollars for!

So What Are You Suggesting Matt, Get On With It Already!

There are several on-line, database-backed, running logs available for free; many of us might already be using such services. It would be a fairly simple task to provide a list of links to members' logs on other websites somewhere on our own website (perhaps the "Training" section?) This would allow members to peruse each others logs, and to save and interpret their data over the course of many years. However, such services do not provide visitors the ability to comment directly on other people's logs, nor does it provide one the ability to make announcements to the entire membership, (as Evan might have liked.) This would still be the domain of the Crow message board. So my suggestion is not a complete solution, but is the best option I see available.

Which On-line Log Do I recommend?

Why, I'm so glad you asked! I have taken the time to "shop around" and have weighed the benefits and limitations of several on-line running logs. Generally speaking, these logs allow a person to track simple statistics like mileage, time, routes, shoes, weather conditions, etc. Some logs allow a person to enter specific workout information such as interval sessions, where one can specify each interval and it's duration in separate database fields. This allows for greater interpretation of the data, whereas some logs only accommodate general workout information, relegating specifics to a catch-all field such as "notes."

Another important consideration when choosing an on-line running log, is data integrity. If you are going to bother entering all this information onto some server somewhere out there in the ether, it would be nice to know that the website will not dissapear tomorrow, or decide to start charging you money to continue using their service. (Both have happened to me.) I have only seen a couple running logs that offer users the option of exporting their data to their own computer, where they can then save it, move it to another database, or view it in a spreadsheet if they so desire. (This also allows you to salvage your data, should the website cease to exist!)

Perhaps the biggest difference between all the options available is their interface. How easy is the thing to use? Does it allow you the option of displaying your training schedule on the web? Can you link your schedule to others' schedules?

When considering all the factors discussed above, I have made the decision to use the on-line log offered by CoolRunning.com. It provides the features I care for most, and what features it lacks, it makes up for with the security a big, well-established running site provides. In other words, "they ain't goin' nowhere" anytime soon. Moreover, they provide the options of displaying one's log on the web and exporting data to one's own computer. Here is a link to my log. Note that visitors can choose what dates they want to view, compare weekly mileage using graphs, search for PR's etc.

The Bell Lap! (Ding Ding Ding!)

So here is what I envision (and hopefully it jives with what Evan had in mind): a page on our website which displays

• A list of links to member's running logs.
• A link to CoolRunning.com.
• A brief tutorial on how to set-up one's own log on CoolRunning.com.
• An e-mail link to whomever is responsible for updating the list of member's running log links.
• A link to the message board, where one can discuss further the information garnered from member logs.

I would also like to see the eventual migration from our current message board configuration to the one Brian has advocated, though that will require further time and consideration regarding how best to go about it. Being as I am the one making all these suggestions, I am certainly willing to take this project on myself if folks are interested.

Thanks everyone for enduring this lengthly post, but I knew you had it in you, as you are all endurance athletes!

Posted by g on November 13, 2004 at 10:47:01:
In reply to: MATT'S AMAZING ON-LINE RUNNING-LOG DIATRIBE!!!! posted by matt on November 13, 2004 at 08:52:47:

matt very good stuff.... I use the cool running logs

lets do something...
Posted by Harry B. on November 13, 2004 at 18:31:45:
In Reply to: matt very good stuff.... I use the cool running logs posted by g on November 13, 2004 at 10:47:01:

I'm an out of state crow who really thrives on this website, it is like no other. To post my runs and see everyone elses would be great, especially with their thoughts- the miles were hard, easy, horrible, whatever. How to do it, well, I have no idea, but I do know that Brian Hubbell has helped make this site what it is so I would be interested in what he thinks. But to throw in my own 2 cents, something that gave you an instant simultaneous look at what the other crows were up to that day would be ideal, if posssible.

coolrunning log
Posted by frank on November 14, 2004 at 12:38:11:

I recently reinstated my cool running log under the name fnewlin.
with the pass word crowf you can all see it. when i was training for my last marathon, two years ago, i kept this log, and it was kind of neat to play with the numbers, graphing them and such. i think that the logs from some of our stronger and more adventerous runners might be a lot more interesting. by the way, one cake is 4x400 with the various other excersizes judson outlined in his circuit workout. 1.5 would 6x400 and so on with other modifiers, ie a"200 cake", meaning 4x200 etc. thanks judson